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Hello. Today is Friday, July 3rd and I am here a part of the time a Proctor oral history program with Ralph Blood and and I am Richard Laziness. And we are part of the Panama Canal Society, where we're gonna interview you about the Panama Canal. So So why don't you start off by telling us about when you were born.

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Where were you born in a bit, about your childhood? I was born my first. I was born in Gorgas Hospital in Panama, in the Canal zone. At that time, that was an American hospital established by George Goethals. One of the first Dr Sick came down to Panama to fight malaria because malaria during the construction of the canal was deadly, killed many people.

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So that's where I was born in 1941. I was born. My father had been in the military, was stationed in Panama. I met my mother. What she's was Panamanian didn't speak English and they got married and I was born in 1941. So my my relationship to Panama's school as first educated in a Catholic brother school in Spanish, totally Spanish, going to the 3rd, 3rd grade, fourth grade, and then my father is an American insisted, and I was an American citizen or in any canal zone.

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At that time, my citizenship was an American. So on my birth certificate stated as an American. So what sites? Once I'm going to Catholic brother school, my father said, No, you need to start learning English because you're an American. So I was transferred where I went to primary and secondary school in the canals all and at first I attended the elementary school in Crystal Ball, which was in Colon on the Atlantic Side for my first nine years.

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Uh, well, I really started the primary school, the elementary school I was because I didn't speak that good English. I started in the third grade. I was really supposed to go to the fourth grade, but I started at third grade because I didn't know how to read, write and read English too well.

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So I was very fortunate that I, you know I did when I went to started. Then I started to learn English, and that's where I learned how to speak English Now went to the Cristo Elementary School there for graduated from Crystal Elementary school the eighth grade and in high school.

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I started my freshman year in Cristobal Cristobal High School and with their for my freshman and sophomore year. And I'm unique with a group that our parents a lot of times would. The way the canal operated jobs would change. So they transferred my father from the Atlantic side to the Pacific.

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Sacked. I graduated from high school in Christo Bob. Oh, excuse me. Babu High School in 1960 also, I was really my my interpretation of Panama. I have my side, which I love, which is the Panamanian side with my mother and the American side, which is my father.

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My father, when he came to Panama, didn't speak any Spanish but his preferred language After later years, being married with my mother spoke perfect Spanish. And you could you know it is complexion. Everything I did a blue eyes, black hair. He was a kingdom or American.

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Myself and my brothers. We had complexion, sisters. Things were fairly, huh? Our complexion was a little different, but it was unique to because we always had. The influence of your mother is also important in a Catholic Roman Catholic family. So that's a lot of my influences.

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Are adapted it. I thought I always felt with my friends. I played sports. I got a nickname Rocky. Well, I was going to school, and that was adopted from a coach that I loved very much from a crystal ball. And here, nickname named Iraqi. So the Rockies, till this day on my mutual friends from school, called me Rocky.

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What I feel sorry about about Panama is how it was handled because he, the American government, the government, I said, Let us down. There was people, a lot of Panamanians who married Americans and their head opportunities. We never really exploited their talent. So there was a lot of times has created animosity between the Panamanians and the Americans We did.

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There's many things the American side of it did so many, many things for the canal they operated. The canal is 50,000 of us on the American side. There was a lot of Panamanians to working from the Panamanian said, but when I say is to be able to have those grows.

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So there was an inter relationship between the Panamanians and the Americans, full blooded Americans who has never that because most of the time they were stationed. A lot of them with military, okay, was the largest. That there was a military basis that we had in Panama.

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There is a lot of training exercises going toe Honduras to Colombia. You got schools of the Americas. In fact, some of the leaders that became leaders of Panama. Manuel Noriega was trained by US Americans. You went to Colombian everything. So it seemed there was resentment created there because we didn't really get all the people the Panamanians involved.

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And that was what I'm saying is to have mawr inter relations with Panama Way. It was very as you went. Central Avenue was the dividing what we call the dividing point. This is the road to road. On one side of the road was the canal zone where the Americans lived and where they ever socialize All houses.

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And then across the street from Central Avenue was Panama. There was no fence when I was growing up. Wiki Co. You know, we could tell everybody what's going on, but where we failed is like I said Now I feel this is after is to communicate to the Panamanians what the pluses are with America.

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And this is what you know, when I was going to school in Central and South America in 1960 there is 19 dictators in central or South America. All of them were affiliated with the United States government or with a major companies. Okay, Brought this about what they what they were saying, you know, through interpreter is the people the enterprises?

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Yes, help these countries. But the dictators they were appointed by us. Because if they didn't think we were a pro America, they were throwing out. Yeah. Today there's only two in Central South America. Huh? The longest lasting, which was in the period of when I was graduated high school, was Fidel Castro in Cuba.

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That was there was all in Argentina had little. You've got our head, dictator. Doulas are addicted. Yeah. All these countries had dictators. You know, all of your country too. We have failed in our policies. What I'm saying is Americans and all of us that were that we never really brought this into three countries.

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The unification. This is the same problem that we have today. America is a beautiful countries. Atlanta Opportunity. It should be not challenged. It shouldn't have to have borders. When you're looking to try to bring people of population, it is very important. That is, your neighbors toe.

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Help them. Because if you help them, you're gonna help your country. Okay, so this is this is part of the situation where I say politically, that's my political documentation. Philosophically afterwards, with looking at this, my feelings or and I always harbored the fact because I have cousins that Air Panamanians and a lot of them were not able to be able to be explored things, you know, theon, pertuan.

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It is because they were Panamanians. But this is where our policy or foreign policy has failed. Okay? Yeah, that's what my summary, whatever is done. As I grew up, I went in afterwards to the armed forces of the United States because it was mandatory for me.

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When I was 18 years old, I had to sign up for the draft and I went into the army. After several years, I went e wanted to travel because this coming from Panama, one of my hobbies when I was a little boy, was I would get up in the morning my father had given me this special scope that I could look out at the canal at the entrance, ships coming in from all over the world, and one of my projects that I had was I identified all the ships where they came from, and I knew everyone of the flags.

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Most of you were coming through because in Panama Canal Zone, which is very, very important, there is close to 60 or 70 ships transfer sing through the canal daily. So, you know, worldwide trade relations went through Panama. If you wanted to go there, if you didn't go through the canal, you had to go through this All the water in the South American, everything else.

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So it took the loading and getting goods from the Far East to the eastern part of United States is tremendous amount of time. So when the canal came became functional that time that they would have taken normally to travel from whatever country they were coming from the East would have to go and video South America in order to get to the East Coast.

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The United States so strategies It was a very good thing. Panama Canal Company was a very efficient organization, meaning they were not military. These were civilians, professionals who did your jobs. What you see is the heritage is like my father worked in the canal. He operated a water system purification of water, which is very important things that you know we did for the country since the water system in Panama.

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It's just it's very good water it is. I mean, I always thought it was very, very nutritional. It's good water way had a good system environmentally, too, that the American American component did a very good job. And this is this. Hats off to the zone. Ian's of the Boy calls onions thes thes kids that their pants, they were born there.

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But their mom and dad had come to to Panama and they loved. They loved that amount to this day. 55 figures afterwards. Way have I have my friends. Three only difference between my friends some of them is that my mother was panda mania and my brother was in America.

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So I had the perspective Ah, lot of Plus, I had the, you know, the language was not a barrier to me were the people that you know the parents are both American. It came from the United States. They didn't speak Spanish. It was very difficult for them because afterwards, to try to communicate with Panamanians because they didn't speak the language.

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And then there was a lot of Panamanians trying to learn English, which helped my hat goes off to because there was a lot of Panamanians and said, Hey, the United States of America is beautiful in their days in the land of opportunity. So I need to learn how to speak English the problem that we have today in our society.

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People think that's communications is so, so important. And if you don't speak to the people in the native language, they don't understand you. You can't go to like I was in Africa, building highways. I couldn't I could not three only ways that communicate with those people had to learn Kiswahili, which is an African language.

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But I had my workers learned because they said, Hey, this man knows he was learning our language and he's teaching us a little bit of English. So it was, you know, a relationship that it ended related to people, So my experience from growing up Panama is that I've traveled all over the world.

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But I learned to communicate with the people that I go to visit, so it's very important. It is very important to be able to learn habits, the traditions, everything it's countries have. That is what happens that that's the only place that we'll have a country or a world where this unified that we see now.

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Then we can communicate our problems and being able to unify and say, Hey, this is where the betterment of our society there's other things other problems, major problems to worry about way can't resolve those problems if you don't communicate. Uh, this is the understand and this is a major problem.

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So with my experience is up bi, racial like us, they are Panamanian, American. My my thoughts of you know, I'd love to see young people to be into to relate with him, and you see that there isn't a bunch of everything. Society is so advanced communications.

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You can get on the Internet today and you can communicate with anybody in the world. But that's artificial. It's better to be able to communicate with people like one on one like we're doing right now because you can express and people can say, Hey, this this is a person is telling He's not talking to me over the Internet, but he's talking to me out of his heart exactly more and trying to express this thing.

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And that's what my point. You know what this interview was to be ableto se Teoh us Zonen's that we call ourselves, whether we were from the parents were all from the United States or Francis. Some of the Panamanians, totally Panamanians afterwards became American citizens or, like me, that I was.

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I had the chance that my mother, because of my mother's heritage family that I could have my Panamanian citizenship. And then I have my American citizens. So today I carry two passports. One is an American passport. One who's a Panamanian passports e don't know. I have a couple more questions or a bunch of questions regarding your story.

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So if you want, we can go way back and then you should elaborate. I know you were talking about how your father was in water management in that area, so if you could elaborate on that and as well as what your mother's role, your mom's role.

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My mother, when she met my father, worked for an American company. It was a film company. Warner Brothers was the name of the company that used to make films, met my father, and then afterwards I got married. My father was a worker, if they did, is an operator off heavy equipment.

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And then afterwards he became on the water proper purification system. So he was educated, too. And the opportunities of the in what I call on the job training here with the Canal Zone. The Canal Zone had opportunities for Americans that they could always advance our educational system.

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Richard was one of the best our teachers that we had there, plus the system, the system itself. When you have people working together and opportunities developed, they advanced. And that's what my father had the opportunity, because when he first came, he was a soldier. Then he learned after he's learned, went into the water purification system and retired work further 20 20/20 years in the Panama Canal because a lot of times it is cheaper and had more bang for your bucks.

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What we would say is that you had people that were in house that you get fully trained in advance. So that's where my father like Like you're like What you're saying to him was an opportunity to because he had limited education. But working at the Panama Canal living in the Panama Canal was better because they already had somebody that knew the environment, already knew how to live there and wasn't gonna be homesick to leave, You know, after your two.

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So the opportunities for their much Richard it's on my father's my mother's side afterwards. And then my father, my father was very insisted. She was a homemaker. My father refused for my mother to work. I had one brother has passed away and I have two sisters.

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So we were rather family. And, you know, a Catholic family at that time for Children is nothing. So that's where my mother afterwards never worked. After she got married to my father, he was insistent. You're not working. She was a homemaker. Good. That's what That my mother's role playing my father's role quit Richard next question.

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Okay, well, I have another question regards to your general childhood and how? Because I know you mentioned one that you have that your mom was from Panama, where that was from America. So I was wondering how those affected Let's start off with that one. How does those different viewpoints affect your chattel?

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Or how did that affect how you view the people around you? My childhood was very rounded, meaning with my associations with school. It was predominantly with American guy Children. But afterwards, where I lived in with my family somewhere Panamanian. So I crossed that line. I was able to.

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I played baseball with Panamanians associated with Panamanians. I had fun with kind of means that I had fun with American. So I had a very, very good rounded. I would say Experience is your talents, that formula. Do what I am today, the fact that you know, I'm a peace loving guy.

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I love America and I see it. And I loved to see the people to communicate and to be able to have a society where it's peaceful. Yeah, Okay, well, on how thin the schooling. How was school? Because I know you mentioned how it first world Catholic school and then when I went to my schooling at first was rather difficult, because when I was in a Catholic brother school, his people is predominantly Spanish.

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So in areas, Latin and other things to do the Catholic Brothers School City, the link English was not tucked in the Panamanian schools. Okay, so that's why I said my father insisted If you're in America, you have to learn how to speak English. So my first starts at school were very rather difficult because I didn't speak English.

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So I studied hard. I had people with the teachers, help me so that afterwards my methods of expression expanded, and I was able to communicate that I was very fortunate not only maintain my integrity with this past of Spanish at the same time, English and that are my basis from my primary education, my secondary education.

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It was an experience which afterwards I learned other languages. So it was building okay, not one language to language and not being separated by the language barrier, which is, I say, is always the most most important thing. And communicate with people that you can't have a language.

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Very. You have to be able to express yourself. Okay? Okay. And I could assume that even though you were. You switched from the Catholic. American religion was a strong part in your childhood. Oh, yes, any of us. Uh, the canals and head Catholic churches. And he was onion.

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America is faith driven Central America. ST. Julian. There's a difference of denominations, huh? And Central America, we have 95% of the population is probably Roman Catholic in America, 95% of the population or Protestant Martin Luther. Okay, so that's that's still religion is a very important thing of all of us.

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Are all countries God fearing people are good people. Mhm. Okay, well, And then you also mentioned in there that you interacted with many people that were racing Panama because you have your own Panamanians that you were able to interact with them can interact. Can you explain more on your friendships with them throughout middle school?

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High school is an example where I lived on one side was the canals, um and it was called foretell ISMs. And this is in Colombia. You crossed defense where that was in your in colon, which was Panama. Between that, we had a ball park, baseball or soft bumper, and I was very fortunate because a lot of my friends afterwards, when I was not in school, I was able to play softball.

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Baseball and Inter relate with poor Para Minute. To me, that was lifting, too, because to me he would say, Hey, this is what What guy? What is he doing playing with mestizos or anything like that? I didn't have any racial prejudice when I grew up Panama.

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I didn't have, you know, Panama was in that respect from my side because I could communicate with Panamanians. E was very very, and I had some friends that came from their parents, came to the people that built the canal, became a lot of them were black and he came from Jamaica because their endurance levels and everything else, you know, with Miller and I think they were able to survive.

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So there are very important culture of Panama. There's a lot of Panamanians that their heritage comes from Jamaica so that you know that it's good to because Panama is kind of interesting relations and it is a center now. Yeah, okay. And I also have heard from other interviews this those articles that there was class system that was old versus Serval in terms of class.

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I'm not sure if you were aware of. Yes, there was a class system. There was the payroll system in Panama. Heineken alcohol when you were employed. If you're ah, full blooded American like my father was, they were called it one class. If you were Panamanian and you were from the other Lord, What the mess.

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This is what we call they were from in the class. So they're they're like that. If you went toe where we bought purchased our goods is it was a commissary. It was a married military thing, you know, because they would bring the goods from the United States the goods after if they came to the Pentagon's way, They had their cards.

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Their Lord, They were paid lower than the Caucasians there, Americans. Okay, so there was different pay levels. There's a pay level for the, you know, the executives of the runners of the of the canal. There was a pay level for the Panamanians, and then there was a paid level for the labor eso There was 33 different classifications to pay.

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Okay, does that answer the question? Yes. Okay. And then how did that both affect you? And how would you interact with other people around the song? Okay, once I knew that, you know that my inner reaction was I expressed them that the opportunities for their advances, it's always there.

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Okay. By studying and by talking and communicating, I think it's the most important thing that people that are educated but progress him anything in life is achievable. If you have the ambition and you have the opportunity so you have to have the those two things is very important because if you don't have the opportunity, you don't get a chance.

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But if you get the chance that it's so so important. Okay, Well and then what happened after high school? Okay, after high school? Because I wanted I was I am very ambitious. I love to travel. So I pursue the career in engineering, went into the military.

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I served in France, learned French, lived in France for four years and then was discharged from there. Then I went to Vietnam as a civilian. That is a soldier as a civilian and built air basis. So I ended related with the Vietnamese people. They like that too.

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Then I came back from Vietnam and I went to Georgetown, Guyana, in South America and I got airports, highways and bridges there. And then after its from there, I got married. So my wife is full blood American from the south. I live in North Carolina and I went and work in Africa before he was building highways.

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So by a lot of my experience afterwards was what I wanted to do is a civil engineer. Travel the world and be sick, do things which are beneficial to people in society. I can tell you there's basically I built when we worked on in Vietnam. Today is a civilian airport that people are flying in and out.

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When we built, it was a military base in Africa. But I went to Africa. There was no Zambia and the problems that South Africa had drink through relations. Thanks. So what? We built the road from Darussalam to Albania, which was the entrance Zambia. And when we would bring copper out on this road.

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So it was a transportation means and everything else and you about past South Africa. So that was another thing, was very influential in the political affairs. Okay, today times, and he has a very good country country. It's progressed a lot because we helped. All you know is a building.

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Things making, make people, you know, medications and things like that. It's healthy and that's what that my major from there afterwards I came back since my wife didn't want me to go to travel anymore. It was enough. So I came back and went to work as an engineer in the pharmaceutical industries, and I wanted to do that was because I built facilities were like in the United States.

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One was bare or they did a lot of blood. Work. Train. When you extract two different graduates from blood, they make different medications. Like if if you're free. Bleeder is an example of person who gets cut and the blood can't stop. They have drugs we make that would stop.

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Stop the bleeding. Okay, same thing we're working a company. Built the facility were people that have diabetes, the injections and everything else that we give those people now for diabetes. About diabetics I worked in a facility were they make the flu vaccines, which is a world problem with flues.

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With Asian flu starts with the birds transported to the other countries and young young adults of people all over the world get flu. Well, the vaccines that we develop, that's in in those facilities I helped build those. So my career, Richard, what I would say I'm very happy that I have done things that are beneficial.

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Not all put here in the United States, but worldwide. And it's been to me, really, Warden, Now that I'm retired, my travels now are strictly forgot. I do things. Pilgrimages. The Jesuits is one of my favorite societies. Saint Ignatius of Loyola. I visited his pilgrimage. Done like, uh, you've probably heard of the trail and people that travel in, uh, in Spain did that.

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And then this February, I went to the Holy Land by myself. So I flew to Israel, ran into car, stayed there 10 days. But I was able to see things. When we talk about in the Bible, things that we can relate, I could see those in my mind.

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I call it like it faces called a contemplative prayer when I could set myself read something from the Bible or I could relate to something. When we're talking about a political problem that's happening in Israel. I've been in the country. I've seen there. What happens? You know the relationship.

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I had a very nice relationship. Is this a Palestinian? Was my guide. I hired him. He is Muslim political abuse. But he was just a good as I am. He didn't. Didn't want to know nothing about killing people like that. No, no, he thought the same thing.

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Communications To be able to communicate, resolve the problems. Mm. Okay, so let's go back. Back toe to you. When you when you were after high school. Do you want me to stand? No. Just take a picture. And so I'm just assuming that after high school, you start engineering in Panama.

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Yes, Well, I studied engineering in the Army and the armed forces. That's where I got my most of the engineering came truck, and afterwards I attended various various universities University of Maryland, North Carolina State University and I had other times of the companies that I worked for were able to say, Well, this man needs to be.

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We want to promote him or to be able to do his jobs of different things. So that was very fortunate in any way. And so my question is, once you were in the military, what was your Was there any culture shop from the time you were in the Panama Canal?

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Sel, the military, you know, mind I volunteered. But it was educational too, because see what? I wanted to be an engineer. So my work in the Army was all engineering. I was in the corps of Engineers, so that everything, you know, it was a game plan that I had.

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Richard. And bottom line, when it starts, when you when you develop things, is when you know I had a plan, Hmm? I have a plan on my life. I'm unorganized in this respect. I had a plan that I wanted to travel the world. And I wanted to build things that I love to build things as an engineer.

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And I wanted to educate people, and I liked it. Society is different, so I've been very fortunate. That's what I wanted to do. It started all the way from when I was young in the Panama Canal and my parents and still understand this. You have tow work and it will be successful.

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Anything you want in life. There's two things that you have that have to have the ambition of the thing that will power to do it. And you have to have faith in God. It's it's very important that is very fortunate, both of those and then going back to it.

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Uh, the Panama Canal I've heard. And I've seen an article saying that it wasn't very military heavy sown. At least it felt like one. And so I wanted to see if you agree with it. And if there was any transition. So you remember Richard? No. There was two parts of the Panama Canal.

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The Panama Canal was a business. Their job was to bring ships through the canal. Had nothing to do with the military. Nothing. Okay, so remember what was a company? The laws that they use their the laws from the state of Louisiana. Okay, was worth some of the laws.

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It it was part of the Department of Defense. But it was a separate entity. The military was on the other side, where these people, a lot of people, came to the canals. All they were stationed there because at that time in the office, you know it is.

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It was a secure some, because you can imagine is an example what people say it's a Japanese. Instead of invading Pearl Harbor would invaded to Panama Canal. She know what would happen then that all the transportation and very everything else is would have been suffered. So they would have had to go all the way around the horn.

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Or if they wanted to ship troops, they would have to go from the East Coast by rail or car, whatever to California and then border plan on a board, a ship, which would take time. So there was an installation. It was in America. It was a military installation in respect because of his protection off world trade.

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So there's two functions. Okay, Panama can always very unique. It was the operational part when I say it was my father was involved, duly, because he was in the military when he first came there. But he didn't like the military. So he got discharged. And when he worked in Panama and married, Okay, so he operated.

00:35:58.470 - 00:36:15.540

He was like the keys. Like we see a lot of these onions, all with his own. You came in so their parents all worked in the Panama Canal. There were some of the parents that they were in the military, and I'm not sure you know that the zone and up the organization itself.

00:36:16.130 - 00:36:34.320

But the military bases they were there, they had army bases. They had Air force bases and naval bases because the protection of the canal for the world was very important. And that was the portion whether it's the military side and my father was involved on the civilian site.

00:36:35.330 - 00:36:54.040

So that's where the distinguishes, you know, a lot of a lot of boys afterwards. That same my age, their parents came down, we're in the military or some came down and just work for the Panama Canal. Or some did like my dad were in the military and where to start and stated making calls them because they loved it.

00:36:54.630 - 00:37:14.060

So that was that was this whole thing e don't know. You mentioned like you would use sucess a metaphor, but was when Japan invaded Hawaii. Was there any talk around Panama? Yes, about it. I'll tell you a little story, which is interesting. My mother and my father had taken me what we had crossed the canal.

00:37:14.320 - 00:37:28.950

And the only way at that time that crossed canal there was what we call the ferry with very you, from one side of it came out to the other side and this is on the Pacific side. So my parents always like to go to what we call the country.

00:37:29.730 - 00:37:55.000

So when we were coming back on December 7th, 1941 which I remember, I know the data My mother always says tells me about this. If we were coming back and I was, they had run out of milk for me. I was 11 months old and my mother said, you know, we had I was crying everything else that I needed milk that time, milk was a powdered milk.

00:37:55.000 - 00:38:16.370

It was called clement, which is milk spelled backwards. So you mix it with water and put it in the bottle. And you had nutritional thing milk for, for the Children are babies. And my mother always said she always used to tell me. She says you're short because the reason you're sure it was you were drinking the milk that I got for you.

00:38:16.370 - 00:38:31.960

But in that powder was a cockroach. Yeah, so she said. I was really treating. Said she tried to take the bottle of milk away from me. E started out on because to me it takes. It just is good. But I didn't care if there's a cockroach.

00:38:31.960 - 00:39:00.840

India. But that's my experiencing off. What? It wasn't relationship, how important I felt or I still feel that they cannot. Could you imagine what would happen today if the canal was exploded? Think of this. What would happen? Number one world trade from China to the United States delay the cost of goods that you get import from China would be ridiculous.

00:39:01.620 - 00:39:22.450

The cost of goods that we manufacture in the eastern part of the United States and send to China would be ridiculous. So you're talking about mayhem? Internationals? So the bottom line when I say is, you know the canal is very important, but I think the canal is the people of the world.

00:39:23.130 - 00:39:44.060

This is belonging to okay, so that's very important. The Panamanians are the custodians of they. The people that have built expanding the canal now are foreigners in that American companies, because the relationship has been a problem. Communications with Panama. This is what happens to our society?

00:39:44.070 - 00:40:07.040

Did they? If we don't communicate, you're gonna have the problems that we have today. Okay? And then do you remember where you were once the treaty was signed in 1977? How you felt? I graduated from high school in 1960. 0, the treaty, Uh, that was signed in 1977.

00:40:07.040 - 00:40:29.240

We know there was a sovereign type. The original treaty was for 99 years. Okay. From 1903 2000 and three was 1919. 0, 300 years, Right with 2000 and three. What? It put it in 1970 70. I've been I was traveling all working overseas on my other jobs.

00:40:30.310 - 00:40:59.220

My first, my feelings air this I felt. And I still feel problem being We did not what I'm saying. We, the United States blew it. Put it in perspective. Meaning, yes, it was right to get the canal back to the Panamanians. But there should have been other inter relationship because this is a lot of problems.

00:40:59.230 - 00:41:20.620

When I left, 1960 was the first what? I had graduated in the Panamanian students in Panama, which was across like I said to the Central Avenue district. All you have to do is cross the street. They wanted to put the Panamanian flag up and it was riots.

00:41:21.210 - 00:41:40.930

There is factions even in, you know, in the canals on this, right? You can't do this. This is a canals. All so it was very disruptive instead of being rational, which it is today. Panama is a sovereign country. I know. In my pass aboard they no longer say that I'm from the colossal.

00:41:42.000 - 00:42:02.560

I was born in the Republic of Panama. That is a sovereign country. And we have to recognize it. And that's what you know the world has done so. It's very important. My feelings worth Yes, from a Panamanian side. It was only right. Okay. Where My canal zone zone inside e.

00:42:02.560 - 00:42:22.930

Relinquish that because right is right and wrong is wrong. Okay, so I was very fortunate. Thio understand that fact. The Panama was for a phantom. It's no longer you can help canals on what we say. Sony Norm. That was for a period of time, which was a lease that was the original.

00:42:22.940 - 00:42:49.730

Original transit was a 99. What we call a perpetual lease off this space of eight miles 50 miles long. They cannot mhm so that zit is very important If that you realize this is not or there's a lot of people that said, Hey, we could create a state that no, no, you can't create the state there.

00:42:50.200 - 00:43:05.260

This is a country. All we had is an egg four miles on each side of the canal, 50 miles miles long, which is a canal. And so that was the canals on territory. Everything outside of that was Panama, So you can't get it. What were you gonna dio say?

00:43:05.260 - 00:43:27.810

This is a territory. It's ridiculous. And this is what I'm saying. You know, I say to, Everybody said, Hey, there's some people that are hard liners. They say, Hey, we should don't know. You have to be logic. The logic tells you this is a country. It belongs to the Okay, Richard.

00:43:27.990 - 00:43:47.440

And how did your family and friends for you, my mother's side, my mother's side and my father's side agree? And he was an American legitimate. The other things that a This is Panama. This is not no longer, you know, treaty and everything else that went out.

00:43:48.000 - 00:44:06.180

You have to respect the laws of what it is. A sovereign laws. And that's what the Panamanian people said. Now there was some of I had some friends in high school. They were they were radicalized, their political viewpoints for just one sided because they didn't have the experience that I had, what I had because I was interrelated.

00:44:06.190 - 00:44:25.540

I didn't have no bounce, e have the American site and have that many site. But I could reflect that both of us and I was, Thank God educated, the people that say Hey, my Panamanian friends, I still hadn't today by his own your friends. It's pretty good.

00:44:26.290 - 00:44:57.230

So, you know, to me it it was inevitable and nothing. Yeah, we have to face the music. It's just like the United States today would try this mass, you know, letting other people from other countries the land of opportunity is here in America. And you know, I said even when I was in high school is to tell my friends that you guys need to learn the Panama experience the Panamanians, good people.

00:44:57.990 - 00:45:14.690

If you need that, they're gonna You know, if you can't talk to each other and be able to communicate. It's gonna be a big problem. And that's what happened because it canal could I always say it could been handled. Ah, lot of better. Where was a gradual transition?

00:45:14.700 - 00:45:43.910

We're gonna have the animosities. And you know Manuel Noriega, who go froze to a lot, you know, he was He was a young man. In early in the early seventies, he was trained by American soldiers and attended and forces in Panama. That's you know, a lot of people don't realize he went as a military.

00:45:43.920 - 00:46:01.100

That's where he claimed the famous a Panamanian. It was work work for the police and that's, you know, which is Panama only has one. The police is everything the army. But he was so enforced and he was fragmented too, because he he knew the same situation with it happened.

00:46:01.100 - 00:46:21.430

There was the communications barrier. So that affected afterwards. The relationships that we had in Panama, we had to have the invasion in Panama. See, that was very, very important. If we had not invaded the canal that's taken Noriega down, can you imagine Panama being like Cuba?

00:46:22.680 - 00:46:47.290

Well, they would allow American or free enterprise and the people of Panamanian people have been suppressed have been terrible. So there has, you know. So there's just the political and the military impact in Panama. Now it's going different ways because you know what's happened now. We have very little to do with penalties.

00:46:48.080 - 00:47:12.270

If the world trade, the Chinese and other countries have come to Panama. A large population, you knows migratory. That's coming not only to the United States. The Chinese from China are coming and living in battle because Panama is the land of opportunity for that too. So you know, this is what this is what's happening.

00:47:12.280 - 00:47:40.110

So we've lost. I'm saying I say to our youth and young people like you guys that we need If we are gonna be leaders of the free world and we are God loving people, we have to encompass and bring people in unity. Fragmentation of people never works, never would work.

00:47:40.480 - 00:47:59.700

Look at Vietnam. We fought a war there. 53,000 Americans got killed there. We have relationships now with Vietnam, and we could travel to Vietnam. We're trying to bring progress to Vietnam. Vietnam is trying to do the same thing. Look after look with you know this week.

00:48:00.370 - 00:48:33.410

Yesterday this week we have finally said we can have a Cuban embassy here in the United States. When I was in my senior year in high school, Fidel Castro took over Cuba. It's 55 folks. I'm 55 years. That is my son Reunion this year, 55 years afterwards is when we have We're starting to communicate with Cuba, the Dominican Republic.

00:48:34.770 - 00:48:52.700

Look, what s so I could tell you what economically the best place is central, South American, the Caribbean. American foreign policy has never taken care of that. We've always worried about, uh, over in theory, robes and everything else over there. Why don't we take care of our people right here in our country?

00:48:53.570 - 00:49:25.500

I say the Americas, our heritage is beautiful in America itself. Why don't we promote that? That's what's gonna make this world happier. It's gonna be problems. So it's always, you know, there's always radical viewpoints because it's politically driven that when you talk about the Israelis for the Jewish Christianity and the Muslim Okay, so there's still three barriers right there, and the unification of that is gonna be communications.

00:49:26.270 - 00:50:05.510

The inter relationships today in the United States. There's Mawr, Latinos doing things Now We're, you know, speaking Spanish in the United States 20 years ago. It's very small. Look at you guys. Look at your heritage that you have found your parents and said, Hey, you seek We come from different countries but we come to America, the land of opportunity And that's what you guys, too, you know, it's not only that what I'm saying when I put my whole text to this whole thing is Central America, our neighbors, you, all of us, all our heritage.

00:50:05.520 - 00:50:23.080

That's where we come from. And that's so important that you guys, after its relate this message, to be able to tell people and say, Hey, the only thing is gonna be successful. We love ourselves. And God says Major, First word in the most important word is love.

00:50:23.760 - 00:50:47.610

It's we love our neighbor. We love ourselves. You won't have the problems that we have in our society. There's other problems that come on. But we could prevail. Okay, Richard. Well, and what message do you relate with your family? Children? If you have any as well as friends about your time in Panama, I relate to my my family, my friends.

00:50:49.260 - 00:51:16.480

Panama is a beautiful country but is different than what I grew up today is to your 2015 on my report in 1941. So there's different, different things that's happened. So we need to be able to tried to converge these people and say, Hey, the message is this This world, We're only here for a little while.

00:51:17.260 - 00:51:43.960

Uh huh. So we make do the best that you can be God loving persons and love your neighbor, which is so so that's my message to my Children. To my friends, to my affiliates and everything else. That's the most important thing for our society. If we are gonna live in this world the last 60 years, we have done tremendous damage.

00:51:44.310 - 00:52:12.890

Not only politically economically, this people still all over the world are hungry every day. Fanatics, If we let fanatics run Nick this fall, it won't last long. It won't last long. Bottom line, it needs to be just like we said, The unification of art, peace loving people.

00:52:15.750 - 00:52:36.360

And what do you What do you think it is important come to reunion such as this one? Well, I think I really think it's our world I've seen. I've been very fortunate because of my 74 years of age, in my experience has been very, very wide.

00:52:36.370 - 00:53:09.260

So my experience There's been a word look, worldly experience. Yeah, which is rather unique because I haven't stayed in one place all the time. I was able to migrate to different seeing different, meet different peoples and see everything. And I think that that's that's the most important part for young people and people not to just sit here in the United States, but traveled all over the world to see the experience there.

00:53:10.250 - 00:53:24.390

That's the most important. In order to say what you can't have this one point of view point. In order to be able to see other people, you can express yourself and you say, Hey, this person is saying This is if your point This is my viewpoint.

00:53:24.850 - 00:53:51.680

So where is the merging and bringing this thing together so that it's all for common? Good. That's what we have to do. Well, I have no other questions, but I'm not sure if you have anything else toe or you want to express. Yeah, I'm very happy when I first walked into, I thought I would be interviewed by older people.

00:53:52.850 - 00:54:12.980

Okay, what I'm saying I'm beginning viewed by young people which are interested in seeing what my opinion is a zone older person with my experiences. Because I could tell you what mine are you people that have not had experienced the same things that you can only relate to what I tell you.

00:54:12.990 - 00:54:34.260

Okay, so it's my personal opinion, but you're still listening to it. And I think that that's very important because that way other people will be able to see It's a I'm sure. You know, just like I said, I'm very happy that you people in your and I'm very happy that you're the age group that you are, because that's very important.

00:54:35.140 - 00:54:56.790

That's very, very important. I take my hats off to you, both of you to say that after is the challenge that there is in society. And not only that, but the bottom line is I can tell that to you. Even though we live here in America, your heritage comes for another country, which is very important.

00:54:56.790 - 00:55:18.870

This is what America is. And in order to where the America that grow more. It's gotta be more people in here. That's very important. We can't say this. America is gonna everything that you see there always that anybody could tell you. Youth, Keep your head to keep your head of books of water.

00:55:18.870 - 00:55:37.060

You have to look and all kinds around you if you don't. If you just knock yourself for your vision that you don't want to expand your visions or you don't expand your education, it's trouble. So I congratulate booties. Thank you very much. Thank you. And be this since the interview.