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All right. Good afternoon. Today is July 3rd, 2015. My name is chances there were here with Mr Jose van Got talking about his experiences in the Panama Canal Zone. So thank you very much for agreeing to do this interview today so we could start by you telling us when and where were you born?

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I was actually born in San Juan, Puerto Rico in 1969 1969. Okay, on how did you know where your parents from? My parents were also from Puerto Rico. Mom, Dad is from Manatee, and Mom is from Catania. Basically, but Dad was military. It was in the army before he even met Mom.

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They got 65. So way lived most of our youth, his army brats spending a lot of time in Panama. First trip to Panama was in 1970. Okay, um, and year or something old something. Okay, so then did you grow up most of your life in Panama?

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Indeed. We got stationed in Panama five times in total. I want to say about three times during the seventies and two times during the eighties. The last two trips in the eighties, especially the last one was longer than a usual three year towards about six years or such.

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Okay, so what are your impressions? Your memories from your childhood in the Panama Canal Zone? That's that's the big question. Well, honestly, the first, the first trip, I barely in fact, the first trip. I don't think I remember anything because I was that small. But the majority of my childhood memories are from the Panama Canal Zone way.

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We're constantly going in and out. And it was always said that I had e easily at the happiest childhood anybody, anybody, any time and place in the era. I grew up in heaven, and I mean that we were very happy. Kids are were four brothers on the second of for our dad was Army, and we grew up on all the post We during all the tours there, we lived on just about every army post and even on the canal zone area.

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So, you know, car Deena's la Boca all over. And we enjoyed it to the max. My parents stopped it. We loved it. I enjoyed Panama was like heaven to me growing up there. It was You know, I e Not just so much to do. So much to see just the nature.

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So many memories about it. Amador the mango trees, the seashells having breakfast at the officers club. But the Bronx going to the church is running in the golf course. Is climbing the trees, All the animals that for the rest of my life I explained to people lived in my backyard.

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Everybody's like, Yeah, you have a zoo in your backyard? Yeah, actually, Dio. So it was wonderful. It was having I've lived in many places. Are Puerto Rico in the Columbia stateside? ITT's nothing. Nothing is like Panama its's. I've been describing it to people all my life.

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The best I could do is just get on plane to go there and check it out yourself. It's best I could say. So. Did you go to school on Dizon? Yes. I went to multiple. I went to school all the way from maybe even started kindergarten.

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I finished high school in Bubble High School in 1987. I did do one semester in Panama Canal College between January and May of 1988. Okay. And so what? Like So this is your parents for Puerto Rico. Did you have interactions of Panamanians? Absolutely. I always say that our experience was pretty unique because not only, you know you have your Zonen's there who were civilians whose parents or they themselves worked for the Panama Canal Commission or some way, some company.

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And you have the military who comes and goes on. We had access to other areas, you know, the basis the PX and stuff like that that many of the Zonen's didn't. But it's a Hispanic military. When I was young, I kind of state to the zone because of age, and I grew up with the kids in the zone.

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But it's out in the last couple of towards the last two tours, particularly, uh, I was growing up and I would go out to Panama more. And it was it was very easy for me to mingle in Panama. I had I had a Panamanian girlfriend for a time.

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Um, it was just It was. I think we got more out of it and importantly, So because, like for example, I'm finally moving back to Panama at the end of this month after 21 years and for a lot of people. They reminisce heavily and very nostalgic about zone, and I do, too.

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But I always say the world moves forward, not backwards. The zone is gone. It's not coming back. But I'm also the zone had a lot of things that made it unique in the world. But one of those things was the fact that it was in Panama itself.

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So much of what the zone waas is still there for me. Panama made that and thankfully I had lived. Uh, though it was passed 1979 past the official status of the Zone. A lot of it was still the same. I got to live as as a young adult or adult in Panama before, while it was still the zone.

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But while I was old enough to enjoy Panama, so I kind of made a transition there. That, except I'd be needed, is almost down there. Be wonderful, but I go down there. It feels like it's still there. Ah, lot of what I enjoyed about it. It's still there.

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It's inherent to Panama E. What are those things for? You enjoy for me? I love the weather. I love the plants. I love nature. Yatom Lake is still get too late. The canal is still there and moving. I like going down to Panama City. I'm going to Casco Viejo.

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I like going to the interior. I like going to the beaches of fruits. You eating all that? That's all inherit to Panama. Don't get me wrong. The Zone had some wonderful things to you know that where you need to the zone. But for the most part, everything I need is still there.

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Thankfully. But that doesn't necessarily make it the same as the Zone Zone was Ah, very unique kind of magic. What? What are the things I made that unique magic? I think, uh, maybe it's the best of both worlds. Being able to having military bases anywhere around the world.

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Commodity. You live on a on a post. It's very different than even live in stateside in the United States. Postal Very clean. They're very organized. When you grow up a za military brat, you're used to hearing the troops running in the morning. You're used to hearing helicopters of beach.

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You're used to going to the theater at a very cheap price. You remember the troops during the national anthems they salute, then who are done in those you know, those things are very unique. You have the P X and all that. So whenever you're overseas and you have you live in a military base like the canals a US territory, you really do have the best of all.

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Go before you get to enjoy the foreign country. And at the same time, you bring a lot more of what you are with you, not just yourself in your family or how you live within your door. Your culture is also present there, the United States and, uh, that that made it very fun.

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And the United States, I think they think Americans in general, military or not, they had a wonderful time in Panama and they left their more permanently in Panama. You go to Panama just second Puerto Rico, 100 years. Give or take of American presence doesn't go away easily.

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And so it's easy to go back. Its pleasant go back Because of that, they're welcoming of that. Okay on Did you said here? So you're a vendor? I operate here is a vendor. We've been doing it for the last 11 years as a teacher vendor. Okay, so how did you get into that?

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And what do you do in the re unions? Just have you here for the way started. Our first year was in 2005. We've been doing it every year since. And actually, when I started in 2005 since 2004, I was already operating as a T shirt vendor just on the side little project I was doing, uh, where we live in Puerto Rico.

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Tampa basically way were selling, uh, shorts to the Hispanic community because when I got here from Puerto Rico, I was expecting to find a lot of Puerto Ricans in a central Florida. I was surprised that we have just about every nationality of Hispanics in central Florida.

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You know, Hispanic. So they like to wave their flag. Eso they all have their stickers on their car, their little flags. But it's always the same sticker. It's always the same sticker, just four or five designs. What if I come up with some new designs? I came up with some new designs and I started selling for Hispanic crowd one year.

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My older brother Pedro, who comes here prior to even our being here. You guys should try the Panama Canal reunion. So I I went ahead and I made about five designs for the Panama Canal. Uh, no. I took five pre existing designs four or 5 2016 designs that I had for Puerto Rico and I adapted them to Panama.

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And then I made another a couple others and we had told about seven the first years Panama designs, and we came in there in 2005. I believe the first time the hotel was the Garibay royal and we tried that for one year. We did really good and we had a great time.

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So we said, Hey, you know, let's do it again next year And I actually decided to stop every other activity. I was doing this faras T shirts to just concentrate on this once a year because it made a lot of money. It was fun. It only had to do it one time of year.

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It made my summer fun, so we started doing it. And every year we got so many compliments and so many people saying, Hey, how come you don't have to constable tigers or A. I would like this and this and that. So since we do our own shorts, I do the artwork.

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I would always have fun going back and say, Okay, well, this year I'm gonna bring this shirt, this shirt. So I got to the point that every year I was bringing about 33 designs, adding year after year. So we started with seven. Right now, I think we must have about 30 31 designs, and I still get request for other things.

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And, you know, I love to feel every request, but this is not enough room on those tables are tables. Looks like E obviously looks like an Arab rug merchant. Just probably 1000 thought it's tall, you way getting restore them. So we just had a little fun doing that.

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For me, for me personally is the one who does the design for the shirt. It's been a really gratifying experience because I get to feel I've always considered myself an artist, although I work and everything else. And at least once a year I get to feel like an artist, you know, and the T shirts on my campus.

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It isn't about selling T shirts. It's about doing the Panama designs and something I know. So I do that. And I always try to create images. Aziz, One client was asking me today I just like to do images that are iconic to Panama. They don't even have to say Panama.

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You see it and anybody who's lived there knows what that is right off the back. So that's how that was. I was gonna accent what is coming back to these reunions mean to you and meeting these people that we're not meeting them, reuniting with people that you grew up with.

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You know what makes this reunion so special? That's a fun and cures question, because I was always the one that I was one of those that I was like, Yeah, the past is the past. I would say the world most forward, not backwards. And unlike, for example, my older brother such I was never too attached to the past, not this zone and all that.

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I was like Panama passionately the canal zone. But I just you know, I kept moving forward my life, so I was like, Okay, whatever. So when I came here, I was actually surprised how distracted I became by running into a former classmates People I didn't know how many of them were here and what I saw.

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You come here and it gives you an extreme nostalgia. Panama Canal Society Museum. That's always fun to go to. Uh, if it's not, it's my brother or my parents or run into a friend. And everybody is constantly telling stories in the halls, whether standing, you know, we're selling.

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And e think we're telling more stories that we're doing selling, you know, so that that's really funny. You know, you always have something that that does bring you back way. We're usually so busy with the vending, but it's up to that moment. Once you're on the table selling that all the work is done, it's just interacting.

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Uh, you know the stories people tell the changes on you start meeting new people that were probably there when you live there and you never knew them. But you you interact with them and they'll tell you stories that are so common and so like, or we were actually here and here outside of the country the same time you were, or we over left and you never meet these people, so it's fun.

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And now that we're moving back to Panama at the end of this month, e think it's helped bridge, uh, for me, 21 years. That's a long time. So when you hear all these stories and people put you up to date, when you get there, you come in and formed, and, uh, it makes it easier.

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It makes it easier. So in these 21 years, you've never been back of my family. I am the only person that I left Panama in 1992 May of 1992. I did go back for a week or two in May of 1996 when my niece was born.

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My younger brother was stationed. Hey was in for Clayton. But I got sick during that that trip and I didn't get out much, so I tend to forget that. But basically, since then I have I have been back. Where's my family? My older brother is married to a Panamanian woman, and he has his kids.

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My younger brother was born in Panama, and he was stationed there for a while after we left. Um, and my younger brother, My dad, my mom have all returned for some matter of because we have a karate martial arts federation and it's mostly based in Panama.

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Had it since since we live down there. So, yeah, I'm the only one that hasn't gone in 21 years, and I got a chance to go in May for a week and a half hours blown away. You've been hearing stories for years, but when you get there, you're like, Wow, the stories fell short.

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So what's your families and thoughts on the can on all that is being operated by the Panamanians? I don't know what my my family's thoughts are. I know that mine, uh, it's kinda city, but I'm kind of like, OK, e kind of thought it was always e.

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I was never the most informed kid while I was down there. I enjoyed Panama to like It was until after I left Panama that actually became interested in finding out what was going on there because I was like, Wow, you really had such a good time.

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You didn't pay attention. But but no, no, I think I understand. And I could be wrong about this. That after after, uh, let's say early nineties, they were having a difficult time with the whole canal zone. I don't know if the railroad tracks following you had come down.

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Basically what Operation Wise and the Canal. They were having difficulty, but I know that now. They're running it just just fine, you know, And And I went down there in March and I saw the expansion project. That's something fascinating. The amount of work going on in Panama.

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It's not just economic growth of building new areas, stadiums, whatever it's it's just it's constants nonstop to me. I always thought that I tell people the expansion of the Panama Canal by the Panamanian government and the entities involved is wonderful because think about it. The canal was a miracle, a wonder to build.

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So now you can expand it, but you can't stop its operations. How much harder is that? You know, that's that's a fascinating about it. ISS. So I just have a couple more questions. Um, you said your family opened up that karate business, Rasha writes, while they were in Panama.

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Uh, not exactly while, but my father. My father, uh, one of his first assignments when I joined the military, 58. 59 was to Korea, and he learned martial arts when he was in Korea, and from that point, and he constantly taught everywhere we went. He was very passionate about it, and, uh, he had he had schools in Panama, just schools at the time for Clayton Andi associated with a lot of soldiers treating soldiers as well as a masters in Panama.

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But at one point, like I said, always kept schools down there. But one point, hey decided to formalize an organization of his own in Panama. It's called the Pan American Mood. A quantum pseudo association these days is just Pan American tank pseudo and it composed of schools at the time on post several schools, we had a post in many schools we had in Panama City and throughout Panama.

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And since then, even when we left Panama to go to Puerto Rico, another is we kept operating it, and the core of it of the Federal of the Association now is in Panama. But we have schools in, uh, for example, here, here in the United States, Argentina, Chile, Brazil, I believe there's a school in Belgium there's a school in India.

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So while most of it is in central South America and the Caribbean, there is some in the US Europe. So it's a big organization now. Way still operated to this day. My father is the head of it. My younger brother, actually, who ranks me in the martial arts.

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He's one of the one of the main people involved, but yeah, the bulk of it is in Panama. Panama martial arts and Panama has always been very, very exciting. Their incredible fighters, they're very energetic. And anyway, we would go be a Costa Rico. Anyway, we take them in our in our schools to participate.

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They eat it up, they there very successfully. So when you found me really had a unique experience because even though you were working there, you're working with Panamanians. So that was that was your life. Yeah, I'd say that it's Hispanics. You know, we've got a bigger experience out of the whole thing.

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Okay. Sorry. Uh um, So you know, I thought that because we were Hispanic, we had more doors open to us and we were able to maybe appreciate Panama more than other people. It was much easier for us to mingle with the Panamanians, go into any place and get around.

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And I've always found that. And I've heard this from other Puerto Ricans who have been to Panama that Puerto Ricans and Panamanians get along very well. And it's my personal opinion that despite the fact that Panama's considered Central America, they feel their people and their culture feels a lot more like a Caribbean culture than the South in a South American Central American culture, that's what stand out.

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In that sense, that's what I'm Dominican Salsa is standing out like me in interviews in like this is like I've always thought that especially because I always thought that that kind of means reminding most of anything of Dominicans. ITT's geographically very different. They seem so Caribbean.

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It's crazy. Okay, Eso What were your since you guys need Panamanians? What were their thoughts on the Americans in the canal Zone and all of that? Since you all knew a lot of Panamanians, what were their thoughts on Americans in the canal zone? You know, because they wanted sovereignty.

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E I think there was always a difference of opinion there. You hear a lot of people, Ah, lot of Panamanians that we're not content with the American presence. You hear Ah, lot of Americans that were not content with with leaving Panama or turning, having it turned in to Panama.

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As's faras, the Panamanians, I met just a ZMA any if not more, who were very content that the Canal Zone was there. It offered them work. It offered that many opportunities. And while I'm sure not everything was a positive experience, at least The Panamanians way interacted with at the time.

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We had a great time. We think they were. They were, they were. They may have been not even middle class, maybe pouring all that, but they were grateful for what they had. They enjoyed it. And to this day, we go over there and we run into him and they're great friends with us.

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And it's good to see that Panama's in a good economic position. Uh, I don't know. I want to say that I've heard a lot of opinions that Panamanians were not crazy about that, but I don't think that's entirely the case. I think that the Canal Zone in general offer it created much, much work, opportunity you know, there's always a political opinion that there's a day to day interactions.

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How do you make your bread and butter eso? That's that's I think that was I think that's unclear. I knew as many people who enjoyed it as not. And as for American friends, you know, are Americans. I don't know. I'm sure they loved it very much because they still want to be back.

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There wouldn't be having this for units that we didn't have a good time down there. Okay? And then So you said you're moving to Panama. Is your whole family? Yes, actually, Actually, my parents purchased a house in Panama in 2013, and they're living there now. Is is my older brother.

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I was wanting to go back S o E was considering, but my father said, you know, hey, well, if you wanna come down, you can come live with us because you're looking to do your master's degree. And Florida State University's down here, the former Fort Clayton.

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What? They call this you that it's a very today and they've been down there for some 56 years or so, she says. Shoot two birds in one shot you come down here, stay with us. You get to see Panama and take about two years at most, and you do your masters degree.

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So for me, it's a win win situation. And while I'm down there, I catch up with the place. And after that, we'll two years should be long enough to know what to do after that. If if I find I want to stay for whatever reasons, or or different, okay.

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And your younger brother is gonna move, there is no, no, my younger brother, uh, have a younger brother who who was actually born in Panama. But he's perfectly content here right now. He's He lives in Tampa and my youngest brother also, they like it here for now on DWI will be keeping another home in apartment here because we tend to travel back.

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Dad gets his B A appointments here and stuff like that. My older brother for work issues and such eso will be living a little bit between between here and there. Okay. All right, So if you can describe your experience growing up in the zone in one word, what would it be and why?

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Wow, Several One words I could use. I think I would say vivid. I was gonna say colorful, but I think vivid includes colorful because it was energetic. It was lively. You felt like you were living life at its fullest in the maxes and at the same time e including colorful and vivid.

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Because, as in vivid colors, Panama, all memories were just very bright. The colors of nature I always like the nature around is the jungles that the trees, the fruits, the animals, the way the sky look, the way the canal, the way the oceans look. It was just a very vivid experience because I'm 46 now.

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So many years later, the memory is still very vivid. E could clearly remember every detail. Okay, if you had to pick a word in Spanish, I would it be Panama? Yeah. Describe your experience there. How would I describe Panama? E Just just be the Buddha. But I could say that one word Just be that I've always one thing attracts me to Panama.

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You feel alive there? You feel like you're living life to the max. So what? You guys were there? What? Your mom make Puerto Rican food or is it? How many like did you combine this stuff? Actually, actually, a mix of everything. I've always made the Puerto Rican food.

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Okay, Mom. There. So, so long, you're actually gonna pick up a Panamanian dishes? So especially the beach and stuff E. I don't have any other questions that another is anything else that you want to add that we didn't cover? No. No. If anything, I'd like to say thank you for this opportunity.

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For long as we've been doing this in the re union, Uh, it's always been a pleasant experience. It's a wonderful thing, Uh, society's been around for for a good, long time. And I hope there's still, uh, around for a good time yet. And it's a good thing they do is because not only people get to react, remember, and share.

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Uh, it motivates. People are doing things a lot of to go back, you know, And we're living in an interesting time on Panama lately has been catering very much to the particularly American retiree, and I think we're seeing a lot of traffic going that way again.

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So who knows? You know who knows what the future holds? Maybe, maybe not the canal zone, but it's the people ultimately that make the place. Eso A lot of us there might make you feel very much to say. Okay, well, thank you very much. And this concludes its interview.

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Okay. Thank you.