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Good morning. My name is bringing Mahia. I'm with the Samuel Procter Oral History Program at the University of Florida today. I'm here with Mr Mr Charles. Joe Veli. Charles, would you mind spelling your last name for us, please? His G i A v e l I Okay.

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Thank you. Um, So, Mr Jibali, I just wanted to start off with your background where you were born on any early memories that you have from your childhood. I was born in 1929 in an con canal zone. Uh, many of the young people growing up always said the boys have learned lived in the canal zone or competitors to the boys and bow, bow and gamble on Peter Miguel and things like that.

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So yeah, household. How so? How? How sports in sports and anything took place. It was a competitive type thing. You know, the young men. And, like, baseball or basketball or football or something like that. What sport did you enjoy playing baseball? Yeah. And basketball and football.

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Yeah. Um, I did a lot of boxing when I was young. Really? Yes. How old were you? How old am I now? How old were you then when you're playing all of these. Well, I was, uh, started when I was 10 years old. And down there, they used to have the Golden Gloves tournaments, and I I think I want three or four years.

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I won Golden Gloves, Uh, with Jack Johnson. He's of a coach they used to teach us. And he did most of the refering where we had bouts. Yeah. And, uh, we had competitors, like, right? No, Donald brothers. And there was quite a few of from ball boy that usedto be in the boxing there.

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So you said that you were born in Panama and Khan canals? Yes, Panama, Right. What brought your family over there? Well, I was My dad was a construction worker, and he stayed with Panama Canal Don there. My dad went down there in 1903 Wow. He's a gold medal recipient.

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What? He called a gold medal recipient or Roosevelt Medal recipients. E think they gave them out every four years, and I think he got three medals. So for being down there at that time. But yes, that, uh, and like I say, married and had Children he had We're a family of eight, you know.

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So, um, just about in the middle. Um, What kind of work? What kind of construction did you do? What? What part did he play in the canal? He was a demolition expert. He went down there in regards Thio on a ship. Uh, torre ne. I think it was Colombia and some of the islands in the Caribbean, and they happened to hit the port in Christo ball.

00:03:49.840 - 00:04:16.450

And he liked the area. So the ship went back to New York where it was positioned, And from there, he he left the ship and went down. And contract ended up in New York with kind of Panama Canal Commission on Went down to Panama. Okay, um, on bond, your your mother, What kind of work does she dio?

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Housewife, that's all. Did they meet in Panama? Yeah. Would you live in Panama? Did your parents did they meet in Panama? Or in the States? My parents were in an con and con canals. Um, that's what that was way we raised the family from, You know, my my parents did, um, is your is your mother?

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Panamanian? Oh, yeah. Oh, yes, yes, yes, yes. uh, on going to school. What was that, like in the zone? What was school there? Well, I went to an con school from the first to the sixth grade. I went to Ball Boy Junior High School from 78th grade and Balboa High School from ninth to the 12th grade.

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What kind of things did you learn as faras in, like, history class. Did you guys learn any Panamanian history? Know? Very little. If anything. Did your was the U. S. History? More or less. Yeah. Okay. You know the canal zone. You gotta take this in perspective.

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Yeah, the canal zone. It was a strip of land. 5 ft, I mean, five miles from one center to the five miles in the other center, all the way across from the Pacific to the Atlantic side. But the thing is, it was just like a military base.

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You know, it was different from Panama City, and you are any other city. But the canal zone were well kept that their own government police department, uh, they had, uh, Fire Department and our administrative people that function in the canal with all kinds of jobs. That's awesome.

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Um, growing up there. Did you have any other family besides your immediate family in Panama and those on, You know, like I just mentioned, My dad went there in 1903 He went back to New York to get his mother after several years, a couple of years and brought her back down to the canal zone.

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And at that time, it wasn't an con or bellboys. It was what they used to call it. Uh, e got a name. She's I can't even think of the name out there. Uh huh. I know they had a crystal ball. No, it wouldn't it construct? It was different.

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Name altogether. I can't think of the name right now. You know, I'm old. E can't remember toys, but let's see what they used to call that. That's where the construction people lived, uh, in the canal zone at the time. It was damn government. They will come back to me.

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The name, I mean, but that's where they lived. And that's where he brought my, uh, my grandmother, his mother and my uncle, Uncle Norman down to the canal zone. And they grew up there and after, uh, in fact, my grandmother passed away there and she's buried in Cora's L My Uncle Norman, which was a youth when he come down there, my dad raised him, and then he became of, ah, on Apprentice down there, Machinist Prentice.

00:08:16.630 - 00:08:51.190

And he worked till he retired round 1940 somewhere around that. But anyway, uh, but my dad, he worked in a on the canal itself on what they call the drill barred and what that drill barged. It was blue, the canal, all the, uh made it deeper Or and then after later on, you know, uh, uh, different dredge came and shovel the dirt out of there.

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And then the suction dredge would, uh there was three operations her filling, uh, for widening or not widening but building the canal. But, uh, hey went through a lot, you know, In fact, I remember he mentioned one time he says that there was a barge next to Hiss and they had been drilling and he loaded the holes that have been drilling and they set it off, and it blew up the barge next to it because there was dynamite there that never went off eso.

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But anyway, also the, you know, the war. My dad was employed and I remember the, you know, World War two. Remember? They used to dim the lights, headlights, That's way. And then gasoline was rationed. I remember that. I think it was a 26 cents a gallon and my dad and his occupation.

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I don't I think that people were four gallons a week or something like that. He was a lot of little more because of the his travels to the job back. But I remember a lot of times we used Thio has kids. You know, my dad would fill up the tank in the car, park it, and later on that night, myself and my brothers and my friends, we usedto get the car and pull it out, you know?

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Yeah, and drive it off and drive a little wrong, and and we'd have a good time with it and then park it, You know that we were all young about 12 13 at the time. And in the morning, my dad Damn, I know. I felt that gas tank opened.

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You didn't have much gas in the tank and because we were driving around, But anyway, that that was my occupation at that time, driving my dad's car. How often did you get to witness? You're not working by one after you were born. How much experience did you have seen your dad working on the canal?

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Well, you know, uh, you know, excuse my language, you know, But you know Donna Canal all the way through the construction of the canal till about. Tell about 1945 I guess. And I can't remember that day, but they used to have the silver role on the goal rule, the silver role where people with not American citizens and the goal role with the American citizens.

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And they used to separate them down there. See the people that were on the silver role that had their own commissaries and, uh, commissary books you never You never went to a commissary and purchased anything you purchased with a commissary book and that tear out, you know, uh, license or $10 or whatever that comes.

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Every book amounted to, but the silver all had their commissary, and the golden rule had their commissary at the time, and it used to come in. Uh, the books were commentary books, you know, But And at the time, you know, Gamboa was just starting to build up Peter.

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Miguel was starting to build up, and, uh, the Balboa and and con. That's the only places that used to be the commissaries. A zai recall. You know, you didn't have stars or nothing like that. You just did all your purchasing in the in the commissaries. They also had clubhouse was at at clubhouse and an con Bob.

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Oh, uh, Diablo at the time. And Peter, Miguel and Gamble. Uh, but and everything was cheap. And I don't know whether your other people that you interviewed before ever mentioned, uh, Mount Hope Commissary. They used thio used thio develop a lot of things that you know for the commissaries, like milk and bottled milks and, uh, pricing the items.

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And but that's that's the way we live down in the council, more or less from through the commissaries. Yeah, um, in your community. Now that How many years is it? It is about 20 years after the canal has been given back. What the canals mint get?

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Well, you know, that was 1999. It was given back. Has been about 26 or 16 years somewhere around you. So after all this time has passed and you moved to the States, what do you think is what keeps your community coming back on reuniting? You know, I left.

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I left the canal. I left Panama or the canal zone in 1980 before the transition. But I was with. So I was in the Navy and I got out of the Navy. I went to college, the canals on college. Would you say you graduate 1955? Uh, see, I graduate.

00:15:03.170 - 00:15:34.850

I got a navy in 54 went to canals on college, but, uh, 54 55 56 on. And that's where I got a But they call it associated degree on board. But then after I I got hired, you know, I by the Air Force after college and I was sent back to Panama.

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You know, with the Air Force as a civilian, how is it Ph. D area? A lot of people in Panama Air Depot, you people from the canal zone would know that term. And then from there we went toe Halbrook and then from all Brooke was transferred.

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Thio Howard Air Force Base And at the time Al Brooks Air Force Base was closed down for flights, You know, because it was too dangerous flying over the civilian community, you know, housing, see, so they'd stop that, and they made all the flights to Howard Air Force Base.

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And that's where I transferred to Howard. I moved out there, and that's from Howard. I I was employed for at Charleston Air Force Base in 1980. And I retired in 1991? Yes, from Charleston. But in all, I gave 44 years of my life thio the government as faras uh, retirement.

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You know, any of a, um I talked to me more about living in Panama before, before you went off to the Air Force. You know, I'll tell you, just like I was telling the gentleman down there and you could listen to this. You know, when I was growing up as a child, it was war war to say.

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And at the time, you know, they invaded Pearl Harbor, and I think the Japanese intentions was to going to Panama into the canal Panama Canal, And what they did is they set up a lot of these balloons dirigibles not dirigible, but balloons, gas balloons with cables.

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They put them all over the canal over the locks so that no airplane could fly over the locks. They became a problem after a while, and they break the cable who opened here, Then the Air Force would certain fighters up there to shoot them down and then, uh, balloons and they when they broke the cables.

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But like I was telling a gentleman, also I remember is a youth that we used to go around the docks pure 18 20 like a and or the locks and seeing many, many ships from the Pacific. They were badly damaged, come into Barb or they had, you know, shops, all kind of shops, dry dogs and things like that, then partially repair them ships so they could go through the canal.

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You know, they'd come floating sideways because they were badly damaged. It tried to write him up a little bit so they could go through the canal. So I've seen many ships, right? For example, I live in Charleston, er, Charleston, South Carolina, and New York Town is there.

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And I believe if I'm not badly mistaken, New York town was one of them ships that went through their say so. But anyway, from Charleston Air Force Base. I retired and I've been retired ever since. That was nine. You on this? Yeah. Why did you choose the armed forces?

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What made you want to? You know what you know as use. That's all we know is government jobs. You know, Don Don, in the canal zone, it was all government job. You didn't have no private industry or nothing like that, uh, like it would in Panama.

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But still, we weren't associated with the Panama. I mean, we could, you know, go into Panama freely and just cross the street and going to Panama. But the thing is, uh, I, uh everything in the canal zone was government government employment. So that's growing up in everything like that.

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That's what I had in my mind. So that's why I was hired by the, uh, recruited from the Air Force. A civilian? They call them civil service employees, civil service employees, Um, as a child, did you travel to the United States? Get to come every as a youth.

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We used to travel all that. You know, uh, Pan canal or the Panama Canal. Government used to provide vacations for the employees to travel to the states by ship. And in the museum, you see pictures off the crystal ball had three ships for passengers, and you and resupply the commissaries with items.

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But it was the Chris tobel, the an con. And I think the other Balbo, Crystal Bowl and combat boy, uh, ships that we used to travel to New York. They didn't go into Louisiana. New Orleans, you know? Um, growing up. Did you speak Spanish? Oh, uh, you were taught in school.

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What were you taught in school? Was I What were you taught in school? Oh, no, no, no. I used to hang around in Panama quite a bit. I rode motorcycles quite a bit. And e no, I had a lot of Panamanian friends. I had employees that worked for me that were Panamanians.

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So Yeah. Uh huh. Um, what kind of what other people in your life or either maybe Did you have any mains or did you have any teachers? That's it. Out, Thio? Yeah. You know, in the canal zone everybody had a made. Everybody had a made, everybody had one made for watching a kid.

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One made for ironing. You know, the clothes that Z next made for washing or some damn thing. But the people in the canals live very well, you know. So that's what I was used to, I guess. Was there anyone that was special to you? Was there any anyone that wasn't in your immediate family in Panama that you created?

00:23:18.390 - 00:23:44.560

Kind of like, Ah, family er kinship with No, you know, the canals on a funny place. You know, it's, uh I don't know whether others have mentioned, but see, we lived in Shaker Street, you know, a shag er street. It was all good friends. And that's why we used to hang around with all good friends.

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And, like, for example, uh, you know, a lot of people for man con used to go to the bank and con play shed. Mm. And that's where you know, during the summertime, you know, there was Ah, there was a good janitor that took care of the ANC on place yet.

00:24:12.540 - 00:24:32.870

E think ever he used Thio treat us like a father, you know, but used it. You bought us out. Chase is out. Pat us on the back when we did good things. And, uh, and I think a lot of it used to drift towards ANC on place.

00:24:32.870 - 00:25:02.970

Yeah. Yeah, as a youth, then after well and all After after after we developed from high school and things like it, we got different, different likings, you know, like beer. Uh, eso that's that's about it. Yeah. Mm hmm. Can you talk to me about your first experience?

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Um, once you became initiated into the military, Um, what? Where did you travel? Toe. How was training? What was that experience for you? I was joined the Navy. Okay. And, uh, I was in the CBS. I don't know whether you ever recall the CBS is the Contraction Battalion and all my time was spend overseas.

00:25:34.150 - 00:26:06.370

In fact, one time I'm no of the border ship. You still like a just like one of them. But we traveled down to Chile. No, I'm not Chile. Peru. Okay. And that was around 1948 49. You ever heard of the Contiki? Uh, that was some European.

00:26:06.470 - 00:26:36.650

Just people thought, you know, the people that but, uh, that were developed from Hawaii and things like that must assailed from from Peru. So over there to Hawaiian things like that. And they did it. They did it. That was 19, 44 9 on a raft on a raft.

00:26:36.900 - 00:27:10.430

It was about six of them. And the thing is, they call the Kentucky tribe. I mean, they Contiki tour, you know, turn here. What the hell Contiki journey, You know, something like that, but that I was down there at that time and it was, But, you know, it's a funny thing, me knowing a little bit of Spanish, you know, the Peruvians, they have all kinds of trinkets and things like that.

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And the ship happened to be, you know, just about this high was a little bit above the piers and they used to end it, drink it. One of the guys must have taken it. Their choice thing. And one of the guys on the ship there must have taken one of the items they had.

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And the woman said, Hey, I didn't get you know, the woman from sailed person up there says, you know, I didn't get something back and there was a gentleman. When he says get him near the rail and I'll kick him in the face, you know, And me?

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No, in Spanish. I heard that. And I told you guys get away from the rail because that guy's gonna kick somebody in the face. So But that was an experience that in that, you know. So, uh, but anyway, that was my trip to Peru. That was a long time.

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I mean, my memory. You know, what I'm telling you is, you know, a long time ago. Um, but I just wanted to ask some more about your military experience. What other parts did you ever did you ever have face to face combat? Yes, I did. Well, I was, uh I was trade in Hawaii and whiny me in California.

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That's where they trained all the CBS and, you know, let me go back. When I was got out of high school in 1946 it was hard to get a job because all the veterans were joining coming from World War Two. They were getting all the all the government jobs, you know?

00:29:04.260 - 00:29:26.920

So, me coming out of high school, I had a hell of a time getting a job. So what? I, uh So what I did is uhh They had a job on the locks for three months doing one of the overhauls, you know, and I happen to get a job on there with a machinist helper and all.

00:29:26.920 - 00:30:13.570

I didn't crane, crane operator on a jib crane. What they call, that's what my duties were. But anyway, the thing is that from there, after locks overhaul, I got hired at the Ph. D area as the Panama Air Depot. And after World War Two, there was a lot of aircraft in the area and parts and brand new engines on a lot of darn equipment down in the canal zone what I used to turn it into the V A T area, and then we usedto load a lot of that stuff onto barges and take it out to sea and dump it out.

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You know, dump it into the sea. And sometimes I like, for example, we get a aircraft wing was a little bit longer than we get on a Cray, a crane or a tractor, and mash it up, you know, and I put that down at this experience as being a you know, operator of equipment on my Navy resume.

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And that's how I got into CBC. But, uh, in wine. Amy, I went to school there. As do some mechanic. Yeah, And then from there from Hawaii from Hawaii Niemi, We got leave right after the school, and I went back to the canal zone for 2 to 3 weeks or something like that.

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Went back toe enemy out. Thio San Francisco. And that's where we've gotta ship to go back overseas. Went through, uh uhh. Hawaii and in tow, Korea. So a za See these? We were attached to the Marines there. And that's where I spent my time with them with with second round, second, second Marine divisions.

00:31:45.040 - 00:32:17.670

So, uh, that's the only navy occupation there. I mean, assed faras we didn't have no navy base way had a Marine. Basically. So I spent my time there. Then from there I went toe Guam from Guam. I went toe the Philippines and I went to Japan on I went Thio Adak, Alaska on the back to Guam.

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And that's where I got out. It's gonna be That's where I got up. You know, while I was in Guam, my dad got very ill and I went up to my commander. He wrote me was get ill and I went to my commander and I asked him for emergency leave.

00:32:42.530 - 00:33:06.310

I said, Sir, my dad's not doing too well. I'd like to take some emergency leave. He says No, he says can take emergency leave. He says we've got to any project going on. I was okay. Give my salute. I left her on. I wrote my dad.

00:33:06.310 - 00:33:30.760

Go see the Red Cross e. And he went to see the Red Cross. Explained his problems. And there Thio, the Red Cross operations. They got me out. Go on. That's great. So I was sent back to Guam. I mean, back Thio the canal zone. At the time it was a 15 naval district.

00:33:32.440 - 00:33:55.910

I don't know whether you term don't mean much to you, but anyway, 15 able to drink. Then they had signed me. Thio. Remember Rodman? Oh, yes. Okay with Assad there was a fire station, Rodman say, And I was the first classy. And the guy was in charge of the fire station was the second class.

00:33:56.640 - 00:34:25.060

So I rank them. Andi, I told may you run the fire trucks and the practice. I'll take care of the paperwork and the personnel. So that's what it and thats from there. I had I got discharged from the Navy from there many times. I wish I would have gone on the reserves or something like that.

00:34:25.640 - 00:34:48.750

Because, you know, I see a lot of guys that in the military that went through life, retired from the military. I didn I retired a civilian from the military. Uh, that's my go ahead. Okay. Um, so I wanted to ask you a personal question about religion.

00:34:49.240 - 00:35:18.110

Um, growing up was that Was that something in your family that you guys, uh, practice. Did you guys go to the union Church or the Catholic Church? You know, uh, I think just about everybody was a very religious star. You know, We went to the Catholic church, and I was never altar boy, but I went to church.

00:35:19.240 - 00:35:39.710

I think we used to have walked in the house to the church, and it was a Catholic church right near the Gorgas hospital, which that's why I was born in court system. But, uh, it, uh jeez, I can't remember. The name is a bit too long.

00:35:39.710 - 00:36:09.100

But that's where we used to go. All of us all in line to go up there. My dad leading the troops. You know, Um um, in your family, Uh, were you the only person that from maybe your immediate family or from from your community that you saw go to the military?

00:36:09.110 - 00:36:39.960

Maybe? No, no, no, no. My brother's rolled in the military to how many brothers do you have for? Yeah, that was a That was a four. Joined the military. I mean, at different times. It all because they each difference. I had one brother retired. Well, he doing, uh, during World War Two, he joined the Navy as a 17 year old.

00:36:40.530 - 00:37:05.260

My dad took him to the recruiting office. When he did, he was 17. He's gonna put him because, you know, he was a little bit wild at the time, So he put him in the navy, and he spent quite a bit two years, so I think it was two years in the Navy, and then he got out.

00:37:06.030 - 00:37:39.500

But I had the other one. Raymond was in the Air Force. Yeah, he spent a little bit of time about 12 years in the Air Force. Yeah, The other one was in the Navy also. What kind of jobs did your sisters get? Uh huh. Yes. What do you mean, What kind of jobs assed faras or the employment down there for women?

00:37:39.510 - 00:38:09.640

Well, you know it Z at the time. Mostly the girls when they graduate, got married or some damn thing like that. Uh huh. They didn't They didn't go off to school. And I don't believe No, they didn't go out to school. Now, um, growing up, Did you know that you wanted thio toe be in the armed forces that you wanted to go into the navy?

00:38:12.220 - 00:38:38.740

You know what forced me? Thio going toe in the military, mother, Like I mentioned, most of the jobs were being held by your returning veterans, you know, and, you know, government employment. You know, there's take so many and the left the rest of left out see, like an apprenticeship When you took a furnished test.

00:38:39.420 - 00:39:08.700

If you got I think 90 points were passing. They got five points extra. So, you know, they they were getting over all that job. Mm. Um, did you receive or did you feel any culture shock when you were leaving Panama are the canal zone and you were going into the armed forces at any point.

00:39:08.700 - 00:39:38.730

Did you experience culture shock? No, no, no, no, no. Because like I mentioned, you know, in the canal, Jerome, it's just like in the military e mean, you're a better off than people in the States, you know, down there. E didn't have no cultural shot. E um, is there anything from Panamanian culture that you remember?

00:39:38.730 - 00:40:10.420

Like, food or music? I like ceviche. Uh, e mean things like that. We used to have a favorite place. I think everybody used to go toe that it was on. You remember the highest, uh, animal school there? That was. They used to have a pizza place there about that with name with e.

00:40:10.420 - 00:40:30.280

Think everybody used to go toe it because it's not neat. Goes Nicos. That's right. Yeah. Everybody used to go toe and see on that. You know what? But the only place you get, uh, Peaches, I guess. But, you know, they didn't have no the canal zone.

00:40:30.280 - 00:40:58.620

They didn't have no Burger Kings. No. McDonald's no. And then after it, just about just about when I was leaving, their McDonald did raise a but a restaurant out there. And but, you know, the canals on a lot different than a lot of places in in the States on a lot different way different than the people that lived in Panama.

00:40:58.620 - 00:41:28.490

You know, it is quite a education down there. Mm. How often did you have the opportunity to go into the city? Are going toe Panama? How often didn't do leave the zone walk across the street and going to paddle? Uh, no difficulty at all. It was no barbed wire or nothing like that just opened, you know, just open border.

00:41:28.500 - 00:41:54.020

Did you enjoy going into the city? Did you enjoy? I used to ride a motorcycle when I was very young. In fact, I wrote a motorcycle. I wrote a motorcycle. It was six of us. It started on a motorcycle and was at first we said, Let's go to Costa Rica.

00:41:55.710 - 00:42:24.130

Got on the motorcycle, took off and we say, Let's go a little further on. We went into Salvador and then reached out on one guy. Go back. No way. Go a little further. Nicaragua. Then another guy Go back and after go a little further. Another three of us made it into Laredo, Texas, on a motorcycle.

00:42:24.500 - 00:42:56.480

Uh, it's impressive. Yeah, it was, uh, but when we got the real Laredo, Texas, we got there that evening. Spent the evening there. Next morning took off back to Panama towards Panama. But the thing is, with it, you know, that highway, the Pan American highway at the time, See, a lot of it was built on a river rock, Round rock.

00:42:56.500 - 00:43:32.950

I ride a motorcycle on him, you know, we're gonna riding them, so yeah, but anyway, that's the three of us Made it back. Yeah. Um, did your father get to see the transition of the zone? No. My dad passed away and he waas 61. Yeah. Um, what were your sentiments when you heard that it was going to be given to the Panamanian government?

00:43:32.960 - 00:44:04.570

You know what? I'll tell you the truth. You know, Carter was in president. In my opinion, he was poorly advised, as's faras the conditions in Panama. I mean, you know, Panama as faras the transition wonderful, you know, because they've done lot down there, but there was a lot of influence down in the canal zone by American influence.

00:44:04.580 - 00:44:38.080

But I think he was a Korean, uh, advised because, you know, a Panamanian, you know, you had the canal zone. Get Panama there and then Panama on this, I'd say. And for the people who'd ride from Panama to Panama going through the canal zone? Yeah. You know, a lot of them had junkie vehicles and things like that.

00:44:38.090 - 00:45:15.080

The police would stop him because they wouldn't meet. Uh, you know, the regulations, you know, for the vehicle, and arrest him and things like that that made it hard on him. And I think is a Like I said, they poor advice. If they would have made a bridge on a roadway for them to travel from Panama to Panama, if they were built that for them and then keeping the canals on, there would have been Alright, see?

00:45:15.080 - 00:45:32.490

Because, like I said, there was a lot of influence down Canova. But but the Panama's done a good thing right now. Um, that was my thought at the beginning, you know? No, I understand. How do you How do you feel that your views have changed? Or have they changed?

00:45:32.500 - 00:46:00.460

Yeah. Well, I say they have changed. At that time, they said God, Carter. Yeah, but like I say is, uh, it, uh It has shamed because many people that our torrent like, for example, how this, uh, canal jewelry union tell me over. There's been so many changes down there and for the good, or it was bad.

00:46:00.470 - 00:46:24.110

But majority have been for the good. Like, for example, they're gonna open up. Uh, yeah. See, the third locks, which is a good thing, you know? I don't know. What do you know anything about the canals on it? All. I know. Yeah, I know enough. You know enough.

00:46:24.120 - 00:46:49.340

Okay, let me tell you something. At the Atlantic side, there's a very minimum of a tide, right? And I go through a big mountain. Yeah, but it's not the climbing the locks. It's on the Pacific side to have a big tight. You have little tied here and big tied there.

00:46:49.350 - 00:47:12.950

Then he never equal each other C S O. That's why would they have to bail locks? That's why they had to build lives. But this this widening the new locks will help a lot of shipping go through and that will help where I'm from in Charleston, South Carolina.

00:47:12.950 - 00:47:45.620

Because that's one of the keep key, uh, parts of on Atlantic Ocean. You know that? You know, like Jacksonville in Charleston, Philadelphia gets a big ship yard. You know that. There. I'm just saying, Um, sir, what was the most interesting thing that you got to see growing up in Panama that you wouldn't have?

00:47:45.620 - 00:48:11.220

Everything was interesting on her. Everything. Yeah, I like I say I used to box down there and I boxed in the navy to but, uh, to me, I was always a good luck. Good luck. You know? I mean, nothing ever. Word me. Uh huh. Um, is there anything that you would like to add that we didn't get to talk about today?

00:48:12.180 - 00:48:23.920

Yeah. Not really. No, no. All right. Well, Mr Charles, I just wanna thank you for sharing your story with us. Alright? Don't you have a great day? Good